Ep 4: From Traditional to Digital Marketing with David Meltzer

Dave Meltzer interviews digital marketing expert Jennifer White, Founder & CEO of 5 & Rise Marketing Solutions during the NBA All-Star Weekend. They delve into the transition from traditional to digital marketing, emphasizing foundational marketing principles despite the digital shift.

Jen highlights the importance of storytelling and community building in marketing, regardless of the platform. They also discuss the challenges of navigating the vast digital landscape, the pitfalls of transactional marketing, and the need for authenticity and patience in successful campaigns. Additionally, they touch on the risks of engaging with inexperienced marketers and the significance of a holistic marketing strategy that leverages both traditional and modern digital approaches. 

00:00 Introduction to the Digital Marketing Conversation
01:12 The Evolution of Marketing: From Traditional to Digital
02:02 Foundational Marketing Principles in the Digital Age
03:08 Expanding Reach: Addressing a Global Community
03:59 The Importance of Consistency and Authenticity
04:56 Navigating the Challenges of Digital Marketing
05:51 Identifying and Avoiding Marketing Missteps
07:26 The Long Game: Patience and Strategy in Marketing
08:42 Leveraging Content and Managing Expectations
13:28 The Science Behind Successful Content Creation
14:59 Conclusion: The Power of Expertise and Collaboration

https://offtherecordmarketingdeconstructed.buzzsprout.com

================================= 

About 5 & Rise Marketing Solutions
Our team has been in the marketing game for a combined 5 decades, and we’ve seen it all. From crafting killer ads to building standout brands, managing social media like pros, and creating captivating content, we’ve got you covered. Whether you’re a startup dreaming big, a seasoned business ready to expand, or an organization looking to make waves online, we’re here to help you grow.

We’ve worked across a wide range of industries, from real estate to nonprofits, tech startups to sports, and everything in between. Wherever you are, we’ll meet you there, bring our strategic know-how to the table, and rise together.

And hey, we’re not just keeping up with the trends—we’re setting them. Join the journey.

 Free Brand Assessment & Strategy Call
https://forms.clickup.com/9017097624/f/8cqbzcr-35117/NY8KENX0U7FZONXMCK

================================= 

Follow us on Social Media!
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/5andrise/
Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/amarketinghub
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/5andrise/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/5andrise/
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmZWpnGFDPKer-scwQLmbUw/ 

================================= 

Simplified Social Hub
Simplified Social Hub simplifies social media management by consolidating essential features into one user-friendly platform. It empowers businesses and individuals to effectively manage their social media presence, enhance audience engagement, and achieve their marketing goals. 

https://simplifiedsocialhub.com/

Transcript

0:00

Welcome to off the record marketing deconstructed on today's episode. I share with you an interview that I did with David Meltzer during the all star weekend in Indianapolis, David Meltzer is an entrepreneur, a bestselling author, a business coach. A sports agent, an attorney, and all kinds of other things. We talk about that on today's episode. Enjoy. I need that story in order to share your message again with whatever we're doing. I can't just throw an ad out there. I ran a test. I did a 24 hour test, 25 pieces of creative, 25 headlines. How do we capture essence, but more community around that essence? And I've told my wife, I'm like, this is embarrassing. Everyone loves it. Hey, this is Dave Meltzer here on NBA all star weekend. Want to thank the Indiana pieces for giving us this incredible podcast studio and the NBA as well, but. Talking about all stars. I have a conversation now with Jen White. She's an expert in an anomaly. And when I say an expert in an anomaly, Jen White is an expert in digital marketing and marketing and understanding not only how do we capture essence, but more importantly, how are we building a community around that essence, uh, via the amplification, which is the definition of marketing. Jen White, thank you for joining me in the conversation. Thanks for having me. So we both have been around long enough to have utilized traditional marketing. And traditional marketing was about the number of eyeballs that we put upon a stagnant piece of content, a billboard radio show, a TV show, a movie, uh, all types of different mechanisms from newspapers to magazines and otherwise. And within the context of about. The last three years, we've really seen an infinite way of amplifying a message or an, an essence, uh, authenticity or brand. Um, how have you been able to take the years of experience that you have in traditional marketing and be such a great addition and asset and expert within the realm, the new realm of digital marketing? You know, people ask, or they think that marketing's changed so much over the time, over time, and it really all comes back to basics and foundational marketing. I think a few years ago, there was a lot of transactional marketing where people were doing things on digital just to make money. We had the pandemic and so people are moving from brick and mortar to online But really in today after all that transactional marketing goes away We're really back to the foundation which is who are you? What do you do? Why do you love what you do? What's your story? And then sharing that with everybody else and then all we do is take that Information holistically and apply it across everything that we do, whether it's traditional marketing, whether it's your website, whether it's digital ads or anything that we're putting out, but it all starts with that foundation. So from my point of view. I don't feel like things have changed so much. It's just how we put the information out there has changed. I agree with the foundational principles. The only thing that I see that has really changed, that you also do extremely well, is understand the total addressable community. So in traditional marketing, we might be in Zinesville, Indiana, have 300, 000 people. That we want to address because of the size, scope, and scale of that community, the addressable market for the brand, uh, software solution service product, et cetera. But today it's uncontrollable. It's, I think, unfathomable how big the community, the total addressable community is, because no matter who you are. If something is amplified well enough, it could hit 7. 6 billion people someday. How have you been able to utilize your foundational principles in a exponential sized, total addressable community? It's really, again, taking, starting out with that foundational piece and then taking that story. And putting it out to the universe so that we can bring more people into our clients universe and we do that through more modern, I guess, um, Media right through digital ads and podcasting. We're getting ready to launch three podcasts for clients this week. That's something that's new. A lot of people were afraid of podcasts and it, it just kind of stopped for a little bit, or they get going and they do five episodes and they quit. But the way to get out there is to keep doing it, right? It's the long game. And that's what I make people do 10 podcasts before they post. So that way they're in the top 1 percent of podcasters. Exactly. Cause they get to 10 and they get better at it, by the way. Um, I'm still trying to get better at it as well. After 4, 000 and some different interviews, it's not as easy as it looks. Um, To also understand there is something that has remained the same since I graduated college in marketing and PR branding is the bullshitters. Um, it's also amplified, uh, by digital marketing. There's so many people that don't know what they don't know. And instead of utilizing radical humility to help learn, to help test, to help you with this situation, knowledge and experience, they make up things. They, uh, are. Arrogant and ignorant. They pretend like they don't know what they don't know. And then they wasted an incredible amount of money, time, value and emotion of the clients who are hopeful that they're going to be able to survive or grow their business. But instead, I think they're the worst kind of thieves out there. Uh, those digital marketers that don't know what they're doing. And literally just know how to post randomly and buy ads against it and have no strategy, no experience and don't ask for help. How can we identify those bullshitters today? I would say if they're not doing things, um, in a traditional sense, I would definitely question what they're doing. And I think that. What they're putting out there if I went to try that it isn't going to work for me It's only going to work for them They might try to sell me that it's going to work for me or they're gonna Because that's what they want. They're doing it to make money but if you really want to go out there and make a name for yourself or or um blow up you have to start again with those foundational principles and then actually take that and Blow that up to get attention from other people. I think it's important that You understand that trends are trends consistency is key. And so if you're just following the trends, it might work for a second, but it isn't going to work for the long game. And I think that's the thing that people don't understand about marketing in general is that it is a long game. I get people that come to me that say, I just want to run ads. Can you just run ads for me? Yeah. I can run ads for you, I can waste your money, but, so we take that holistic approach, so whether you're running ads with me, or you're building a website with me, or you're doing a logo, or you're doing a brand from point A to point Z, there's a story in there that we need to capture, and I need that story in order to share your message, again, with whatever we're doing. I can't just throw an ad out there and not know where it's coming from. I need to know your story and to that measure, one of the biggest lessons that we need to manage as leaders in marketing is patience, um, because we attach our emotions to the outcome. And so, as we're spending money, as we are posting, as we are buying ads against those posting, even if we have a message, a communication that's consistent with our essence and our frequency and building that neighborhood. I haven't met one person that has hired someone like you that doesn't get impatient, all impatient. You know, like I always say that being a lawyer, being a lawyer was so hard because if you did a bad job, they wouldn't pay you. And then if you did a good job, they thought you could get more. And you still risk not getting paid, which is why I always say being a lawyer, 80 percent of being a lawyer is just getting paid. Um, the same really holds true in marketing that the expectations are so hard to manage, not only because there's so many bullshitters saying, I can do this and that. And my question is some of the guys who exaggerate. What they can do for you. I'm like, well, why don't you just do it yourself, right? Like what, if you're that good, then why don't you just do a podcast and get 2 million downloads in a week? Uh, and I'd be glad to pay you after you did it for yourself, because if you could do it yourself, you can do it for me. Exactly. Um, how, how do you manage the expectations that this is a long game and truly to be successful, it's a long game, even with the big brands. I think, I think proof is. In what we do right where we we take them through a process, we have our own process that we have a five and rise marketing that we do. But I think also it's I just had a client the other day that said. You know, I don't really like some of the content that you're running. We want all of our content to completely be us. This is for a digital ad client. I want it to be completely us. I want our pictures, our people, our this, our that. And I was like, that's awesome. I want to be able to share that because it's your content. But when I'm putting your content out in front of people to get their attention, it's about them liking it. Stopping the scroll reading a headline to click on it. And then, um, then going to whatever you're offering them, right? But if I'm looking at your face or your office or your team, and that's not stopping the scroll, then we got to try something else. They think that they know, right? So I, in that case, I ran a test. I did a 24 hour test, 25 pieces of creative, 25 headlines, 25 captions, put it all together. This is what works. And they were like, Oh yeah, my family isn't really getting it. Is it? Yeah. I mean, look, and just to, you know, give and gain credibility in what you do, I think it's funny. I love threads because it is the best instance of this for me is I will take a quote, which I think is absolutely Dave Meltzer genius. Right. And I, I'm like, Oh dude, you got to post this. Right. Right. And so you. And don't agree with me like, Oh my God, that's amazing. You know, this is like Einsteinian stuff that I've studied for years. Physics, quantum physics, it's aligned with the universe. And I posted up there and it sucks. Like literally it's like two replies and you know, 20 people comment or whatever. Then they'll send something to me some days and like, Hey, we want to post this. I'm like, that's not even proper English. Like literally, I will say that's like a double negative or. I was an English major in college and like my OCD, I'm like, uh, that thing sucks. And I'll tell my wife, I'm like, this is embarrassing. Boom. 2. 1 million views. Everyone loves it. And I'm sitting there going, why do I even? Bother because leave it to the experts, leave it to the people. And like you said, you have to test, uh, because you never know. And there is also a wild card involved that you have to take into consideration that every once in a while, there's just a wild card that somebody gets ahold of it, that has just an extraordinary reach that is resonating exactly with what you did set or, or posted, and it just goes viral. And it's not going to happen again because it's just that one person. So now you have to have the outlier type of circumstance. And that's why you need to hire someone like Jen way, because if you're not doing this every day for so many clients, you're in such a narrow social silo that you're taking data and you're giving it far too much importance. And that's why. I hire people like you to tell me, Hey, you know, Einstein, you know, even Einstein wasn't understood for 10 years. And if Einstein posted E equals M C squared, if this is true, just from factual historical knowledge, if Einstein today, if nobody knew that theory equals MC squared, it would take 10 years before anyone would even think it was, uh, not anything but insane, right? And you've got to remember that when you're working with someone like Jen to understand that the practice, the understanding that the holistic approach is never been more valuable. Like in the old days, like posting a billboard, you didn't necessarily have to have a thousand billboards because you've driven by them yourself and it was very limited in the soap sky scale. And you can just be clever and know that the million cars that drove by. That, you know, that clever dunk Kings ad with Tom Brady and Matt Damon and Ben Affleck is going to work, but that doesn't work on social. You could have posted some of those without the, uh, exposure at the Superbowl, you could post something in that, that clever commercial could do shit compared to like my double negative wrong, Bad English language post that would beat Tom and Matt. And I laugh when some of my stuff beats guys like that. Um, there's a science behind all of that though. There's a science behind that double negative bad English, right? You would know, not me. See, that's, that's why you hire you behind that. But, um, if you look at, you were asking me about, um, content creators that are out there trending, right? But they're trending, but they're. Not putting out good information, but there are those that are also studying it. Um, one of the things I was thinking about is, um, Mr. Beast, right? He's like the top YouTube out there. I didn't even know who he was, but I knew the science because he actually takes everything that he does and he drills it down to a science. And like, one of the things that. Everybody is doing now, which is a trend, but it's working because of our attention span is lessening is you have to change what you put out their video like every four seconds. Like you have to do something with that video every four seconds so that you can capture the attention. Now that somebody that's actually tested all the content that's gone out there and it's working. And so those are people that I would recommend. Thank you. Look at, because they share what they're testing. Right. And then to add to the experience that's necessary for people like Jen is every platform has its own, uh, demographic of user within those demographics or different demographics. And then you have short, firm, long form in different audiences, whether you're in Facebook, fan pages, Instagram, LinkedIn, YouTube, reels, or just tick tock and, uh, Or they can be like you and do it all. That's the secret, but you have to be consistent. Uh, but I will tell you when I think of Jen White, uh, it is a testament to what I believe makes everyone successful and is asking for help. Find someone who sits in a situation you want to be in, uh, that has the skills, the knowledge of who And what in the desire with the good intentions to help you build a community of people that are going to buy from you and sell for you. That's what Jen's able to do. And I'm so grateful that I have the opportunity to speak with you and have a conversation. Another All Star here at NBA All Star Weekend. I want to thank the Indiana Pacers for bringing in such a great All Star and allowing us to use their studio as well. Thank you so much, Jen White, for the conversation on digital marketing. Thank you for having me. Really appreciate you. Appreciate you. Thank you for listening to today's episode of Off the Record, Marketing Deconstructed. If you would like more information about our team, you can follow us on social media at 5andRise. Or you can visit our website at fiveandrise. com. We invite you to share, subscribe, and leave us a review and tune in to our next episode.